The BrewTools Fanboy Thread

[Bad 'Ed]

I can see now how ridiculous I’ve been, so, after a lot of thought, I've decided to sell my main fermenter.

Lol, very good.

[Bumster McGee]

OMG this thread is amusing . I am not quite sure why all the hate though.

[MashBag]

OMG this thread is amusing . I am not quite sure why all the hate though.

The yeast I use don't ring me and ask for overpriced stainless wank. Sorry that was meant to be 'tank' but I had already submitted the post.

[Bumster McGee]

OMG this thread is amusing . I am not quite sure why all the hate though.

The yeast I use don't ring me and ask for overpriced stainless wank. Sorry that was meant to be 'tank' but I had already submitted the post.

but yet still cheaper than the Deutsche product in its most basic offering. Now then if you really want some intrepid homebrew porn check this out:

https://www.themodernbrewhouse.com/the-system/

[MashBag]

...... that even has stainless fittings on the waster pipes.

[McMullan]

OMG this thread is amusing . I am not quite sure why all the hate though.

What hate? ‘Hate’ is a very strong term. How do you define ‘hate’? Maybe your first language isn’t English? ‘Hate’ sent people to death camps. By the way, that fat bloke from YouTube should just quit beer altogether, not just home brew. That’s my professional opinion. If he carries on as he is he’ll be dead in a year or two. Haven’t you noticed how other prolific home-brew PoohTubers have turned into a form of public liver disease? Some people will sell anything at any cost. Maybe they should have tried harder at school

[Bumster McGee]

OMG this thread is amusing . I am not quite sure why all the hate though.

What hate? ‘Hate’ is a very strong term. How do you define ‘hate’? Maybe your first language isn’t English? ‘Hate’ sent people to death camps. By the way, that fat bloke from YouTube should just quit beer altogether, not just home brew. That’s my professional opinion. If he carries on as he is he’ll be dead in a year or two. Haven’t you noticed how other prolific home-brew PoohTubers have turned into a form of public liver disease? Some people will sell anything at any cost. Maybe they should have tried harder at school

Hey McMuffin, don't be such a sensitive sausage . Shall I use the word disdain, contempt, or scorn instead ? ok then. Actually I do agree with some of your points as I consider a purchase of this unit, the BT fanfare following is a tad OTT but then there is also a fan club for the BM machine, though is still out as to who polishes their kit to the best shine . Your denunciation of the said pootuber is understandable, the sales pitch is a tad OTT but there are many people that try to make a living out of the advertising revenue that pootube offers in return for attracting a critical mass. That is his choice and ours not to watch it, I doubt he is paid directly by BT as he seems one of a few homebrew kit brewers out there that want you to subscribe but no doubt they do get free kit to try out.

I agree that the overflow pipe "solution" to a stuck mash is nonsense, all it seems to do is protect the high watt density elements from burning, it does not fix the problem of a slow or stuck mash, but I see the issue of a stuck mash in any brewing system is almost always the fault of the user, not their equipment. I also agree that the 3 way valves may be an issue to clean but pretty much any valve that carries wort is going to gather gunk over time. Are they manufactured in China ? Maybe but Eastern Europe is also a pretty cost effective way to manufacture. In any case your iphone is also made in China, no issue so long as it is to your specifications and QC standards and not off the shelf from the lowest cost vendor.

Like you McMuffin, I am also a BM user though I am using a second Gen 50l model and I am actually done with it. Not because it fails to do what it was designed to do, but I am tired of working around the lousy 13kg malt pipe capacity, slow boil rate, lack of CIP and that damn lousy non IP graded controller with the misting problem that was never solved. Yes they have introduced now a 3rd gen unit, with a very useful cooling jacket on the rim and a drain cock. Whether it has a concave base for CIP draining I do not know, and the controller is now finally IP 65 rated with built in wifi. By comparison, the competing B80 can hold 20kg of malt, has true CIP capabilities, configurable heating elements up to 6KW combined and a single pump that can be used in multiple ways including mechanical whirlpooling and wort transfer. But I have always liked the upflow fluidisation of the BM design, and while it does not prevent a stuck mash (wort fountains are common for those that are a little over zealous with their crush or malt weight) the configurability of the BT seems immeasurably superior though its learning curve looks steeper.

Bit of a tough call, with the BM familiarity weighing high, but wait a minute, the Speidel shop for the 50l unit is 2600 Euro before freight while the BT shop for the B80 is 1750 Euro delivered anywhere in Europe ? Am I comparing apples with pears ? Didn't you say that the BT was the most expensive kit on the market or have the Germans decided they must also outdo the Norwegians on price as well ?

[MashBag]

Your are comparing apple and Samsung. Apple is an appliance the latter is fully configurable.

Ditto BM & BT.

I am a BM gen1 user and it is brilliant. But what a fooking mess they made in 2015...

[McMullan]

@Bumster

Yes, the BT 3-way valves are cheap Chinese jobs. You can get them on AliExpress, if you’re interested. My Blichmann G2 Linear Flow Valves don’t collect any gunk, especially after I run my BM CIP protocol. If you want to drain a BM completely, for cleaning/rinsing, use a dip tube:

I don’t have any issues with boiling in a BM, but I do brew in a warm kitchen and I use Speidel's domed lid. The insulation jacket helps too, but my main use for it is to sometimes keep cooled wort cool for a while. Given that the machine is automated to a fine level of German engineering, it’s just a case of planning and walking away, if you find yours is slower than your expectations. Take the dog for a walk. Paint a watercolour. Or whatever. The great thing about automation is time. You can't put a price on that

I don’t have any problems with the malt pipe capacity. It’s more than sufficient for my needs. English ales mainly. Occasionally (maybe once or twice a year), I’ll brew an imperial strength beer. Not difficult with a BM. Especially if you have 2 malt pipes. I have the optional small malt pipe too. Just involves a little planning. Double mash and/or add brewing sugar. Not really rocket science as such. To be honest, if it’s that much of an issue for you, maybe you should take up wine making instead

I recirculate wort in my BM using a Blichmann RipTide pump, so ‘whirlpooling’ and transferring wort is a breeze. So is pushing wort through a HopRocket (sometimes 2) and a CFC. I can highly recommend the RipTide pump. It’s the dog’s bollocks. I use it for CIP too. And on my keg cleaner.

If you don’t mind the drudgery of hands-on wort making (the BT really is a very expensive 3V system in one pot) and your budget is at least double that required for a new BM, it’s your choice to waste money. Note there are lots of expensive ‘compulsory extras’ with a BT. If you do go for a BT just remember that I'm having more fun while my BM makes wort for me. That's what it's supposed to do, once you break into that kind of price level

Edit: The nice people at Brewuk can provide you with a new 50L (2021 model) BM for £2,250.00. It works, as advertised, out of the box. The nice people at Maltmiller will do you for a BT80 for £1,899.00. It won't work, as advertised, out of the box. It's a base unit. You'll need a so-called accessory kit. If you really want to knock yourself out cleaning gunk from cheap Chinese valves, I would have to recommend the kit with 3 extra valves. That's £980.00. If you need any advice on BT FVs, let me know Alright? You're welcome. Cheers!

[McMullan]

By the way, Bumster, don't forget the private BrewTools FaceJob group. There you'll find people insisting you 'thaw out' your 'frozen' hops in a fridge for a day or two before dry hopping and others insisting how fantastic stainless steel polish works on the inside of the BT and even inside kegs. There's a word that enters my mind at this point. A very bad word. The baddest of them all. It begins with 'c' and ends with 'unts'.

[Bumster McGee]

Looks like you have some practical mods on your 20l system there, so this actually not German precision engineering, there is also some genuine McMuffin engineering going on there too, well done. It must have taken some balls to drill into the pot for the cooling mod, most BM owners I know would never undergo self surgery like this .

I see you also have the trusty gen 1 controller, because the gen 2 controller disaster is one of the main reasons I am looking to change. I have the 50l model and I cannot agree that a dip tube allows you to drain the unit completely, tilting and all, I still have to rinse and tip many times before I am satisfied that it is clean. I know what you mean by CIP, but all I need is the ability to not have to clean without having to always unplug, carry, lift and tilt, and we all know what one drop of water near that controller can mean. For that, a concave base and a central drainage port is required. No self surgery of mine could achieve that, negating resale value aside.

I will agree with the set and forget of the BM, I always dough in at 38, ramp up with several steps to a final mashout at 76 and yes I woo will consider that an open window for more than 2 hours to do something else. I also do full volume mashes and find only a slight decline in mash efficiency vs a sparge. But I can't see why this would not be possible on any other 1V unit once it is dialled in ?

I have taken a look at the Facelift group on the BT but sadly it is not a forum based construct so searching for anything useful is excruciating. I see the big guy in the pic above is a moderator there.

[MashBag]

I can see you had issues with a gen2 BM. Get that.

But I think you may be in danger of throwing the baby out with the bath water.

I too wanted FULL CIP (with spray heads) and have TRIED all manner of things. What I wanted was "come back and its clean". I can't get there.

I know what you mean by CIP, but all I need is the ability to not have to clean without having to always unplug, carry, lift and tilt,

That is easy and how I clean everytime. No kettle surgery required just a few fittings underneath.
... Have I mentioned the lower pumped tap mod before

All you then need is water, a bog brush and TFR.

... And if your gen2 controller is fooked, replace it. There are options.

If you are thinking about brewtools you are buying a chassis to build your own and clearly not shy of "fiddling" with stuff. Change your view. Use your existing BM as the chassis. The basic premise of the BM is still there and it is the reason you bought it in the first place.

[McMullan]

My mods haven’t altered the simple but effective (and fail-safe) automated mashing process engineered by Speidel. And, of course, the Germans know how to make beer. My mods are more to do with post-boil wort recirculation: whirlpooling, cooling, transfer and CIP.

The new BM model has a bottom draining tap. (Note too the new pumps are adjustable. If 'wort fountains' are a problem, I only get weak ones in very small beers/very thin mashes, dialing down the pump speed deals with it ) My dip tube at 6 o’clock drains the unit completely. Obviously, water being water, there’s going to be the odd water film puddle and a little trapped in the pump plumbing needs to be tipped out, but I don’t move the BM after filled with water for mashing until it’s clean and shiny inside. It requires the domed lid with seal, some TC fittings, a spray ball and an external pump. A doddle

[MashBag]

Not sure that's how I would fix wort fountains. But that's off topic.

I do like you cip idea, can I ask some details..
What pump?
What chemical?
How long does it take ?
And is it SPOTLESS?

[McMullan]

It’s exactly how to deal with wort fountains. As the pump speed is reduced they disappear, as the pressure drops. No drop in mash efficiency either, interestingly.

Blichmann RipTide pump. Hot (70℃) PBW (tsp/L), 8L total. How long it takes depends on how long I take to clean up, usually about an hour. It doesn’t speed up the chore, just makes it a lot easier. About 5min on a physical clean (cask brush) and water rinse, including flushing CFC; about 15min recirculating hot PBW through CFC, valves, tubing, with BM pump on; then about 15min through spray ball; about 5min rinsing in reverse, spray ball, CFC… done. There’s still cleaning-out-of-place chores and pitching yeast, etc., to do. I just pop back to the kitchen when a timer buzzer goes off, if I hear it. Works for me.